Why doesn't your server use Minecart Mania? A civil question and answer.

Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by Afforess, Jun 10, 2011.

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Why doesn't your server use Minecart Mania?

Poll closed Jul 8, 2011.
  1. Minecart Mania takes too long to setup/install/configure

    3 vote(s)
    3.3%
  2. Minecart Mania is too big/bloated

    7 vote(s)
    7.6%
  3. Minecart Mania is too confusing

    5 vote(s)
    5.4%
  4. Minecart Mania causes too much lag

    14 vote(s)
    15.2%
  5. Minecart Mania's user support is terrible

    1 vote(s)
    1.1%
  6. Minecart Mania interferes with another plugin I like more

    2 vote(s)
    2.2%
  7. I prefer Falsebook's Carts

    5 vote(s)
    5.4%
  8. I prefer Craftbook's Carts

    3 vote(s)
    3.3%
  9. I prefer vanilla (Notch's) Carts

    31 vote(s)
    33.7%
  10. Other (Please Explain)

    21 vote(s)
    22.8%
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  1. Offline

    dak393

    Since the implementation of powered rails and detector rails haven't found a need for plugins like craftbook or MM. I like to support vanilla when I can and don't feel like its missing something :)
     
  2. Offline

    eastonch

    I'm in mixed opinions, i like it, i've never used it. I love the idea, but the plugin itself looks / feels to me like it's bloated. & it's pretty confusing.
     
  3. Offline

    Nori_Silverrage

    I have it installed but haven't used it... Yet. The main reason is that it is confusing, which may not be a problem with the plugin and more a issue with me taking the time to figure it out. I actually have a few plugins installed that I don't use yet(falsebook as well). Documentation is good, for sure, though more and up to date tutorial videos/demonstrations would be cool. I really want to like this mod :) I think the work you do is great, such as the backpack and quickstash plugins. Can't say that I've tried configuring it out of the box, but then I don't think it is conflicting with my other plugins.
     
  4. Offline

    Fijgum

    I don't use it because it kind of takes away big parts of the game. Friends and I built minecart stations with redstone, booster rails etc.
    When I got bukkit it was one of the first PIs I tried and I liked it but... Well automated farms and woodcutter - I can just spawn it via console if I use that kind of automation.

    EDIT: Don't get me wrong, the features are crazily awesome.
     
  5. Offline

    Plague

    I prefer simple plugins, like all I did. We are only two guys on a creative playground, so there is no need for that sophisticated plugin (and of course sophistications gets bloated very easily, which I hate too).
     
  6. Offline

    Afforess

    Again, a big hearty thanks to everyone who posted. You've given me a lot of ideas for the direction to take the mod. Feel free to keep posting complaints/ideas, and I'll make sure you guys are the first to see the radical changes I've got planned.
     
  7. Offline

    Tordur

    Hey, Afforess. I voted other, as when the new booster tracks came out, i saw no need to use MM anymore. But i did use MM before the update, and that was a really useful plugin. I simply like it the simple way. But maybe when the new modding API comes out, there will be more options for creating new and interesting blocks which could be minecart related, correct me if I am wrong about the modding API thingy.
     
  8. Offline

    RustyDagger

    Voted for other because of the inconstancy of the plugin one update some thing would work the next it would be broken it was a never ending loop of things not working in the end i just said F it i don't need the headache. and removed the plugin never had to stress about updating my server since.

    and its not because you would change the way some thing worked it was just due to bugs from where you had changed some thing unrelated.
     
  9. Offline

    Chasingu

    I used it all the time, but the Boosters sort of made it obsolete.
     
    acetech09 likes this.
  10. Offline

    Zach Hinchy

    I know you're not really looking for opinions of people who use and enjoy Minecart Mania, but I can't help but feel this is relevant: the XML minecart mania config is frustrating, and unlike the actual plugin usage in-game, is poorly documented. For all YAML's flaws, it'd be a lot more readable than this. I love the plugin, but I hate the configuration.
     
  11. Offline

    tha d0ctor

    I still use it so I guess I shouldn't post here :/
     
  12. Offline

    croxis

    This may be in the list of bad ideas but here is a thought. XML works great for data storage, for things like the block types and effects. I remember you mentioned Civ 4 modding as an influence and I agree with your reasoning for that. However the "simple" config options that most people touch XML can be kind of excessive. One option is put those commonly used "simple" config options in yaml while the xml can hold the block data where, I assume, the defaults are good enough for most people.
     
  13. Offline

    matejdro

    When i still had small private server (times when MM was just gold block boosters), i considered it but later decided that i wanted my map to function plugin-free (so when i installed vanilla, minecarts would still work as only way to travel fast since teleports would be down) and since i wanted to make minecart boosters anyway.
     
  14. Offline

    acetech09

    Voted 'Other' since we don't use minecarts on our map much, and when we do, Notch's boosters/detectors work fine for our needs.

    Used to use it more but your plugin got nerfed with Notch's Rails.
     
  15. Offline

    fugue2005

    when i started using MM it was pretty much boosters and breaks.

    i kept updating it without much thought, and giving my users full permissions.
    then one of my players showed me his farm. and i thought it was pretty neat. but very very laggy.'
    i still have it installed for the minority who still wanted it, and in the past have changed things like making a single block that spawns a cart, loads the player and launches him. but was still lagged.
    so i personally stopped using it, but if as you say you have addressed the lag issues i would certainly love to have a world spanning rail system again.
     
  16. Offline

    THEK

    iMine uses Minecart Mania but I don't encourage huge Minecart builds. It's nothing to do with MM itself, Minecarts are just so laggy on the server that it's impossible to use them. I've tried them on an empty server without Minecart Mania and they're still laggy.
     
  17. Offline

    Kainzo

    With 80-100 players basically 24/7 on Herocraft - we're unable to have plugins that are not stream lined in all areas.
    CPU issues / tick degradation is why I haven't fully installed it. I don't believe that Falsebook or Craftbook has better performance though.
     
  18. Offline

    Afforess

    There are permissions for automations - just restrict them. ;)



    Valid answer - and...


    Yes - definitely a worthwhile consideration. Being a fan of Herocraft myself, I know exactly how laggy big servers are already.
     
  19. Offline

    Windwaker

    In my humble opinion, I think MM is great, but not practical. To use it you have to read the documentation and has many features. This is very off-putting to users and I know if I got it I would be the only one who ever used it. I don't really want to do an extensive tutorial to my users whenever someone wants to use it and most people are just to lazy to read documentation. In my opinion it's not the hosts, it's their users.
     
  20. Offline

    spades001

    basically...
    I must say, the configuration is definately the killing aspect of MM. I opened it and promptly closed it. I run a private server with roughly 5~10 players. While MM has always been installed, we couldn't really find much use for it. The stations were nice, but thats about it (practical usage wise). While many of its features are definately nice (its never bad to have too many!), many won't really be used on a day-to-day basis in minecraft. As the server is just for friends and half are on a LAN network, we don't use a dedicated server. Performance matters and since MM is quite a large plugin, it uses quite a bit of resources to do largely nothing (as we don't really utilize it).
    --
    I do suggest you further break MM down into smaller plugins as an option for admins who just want specific features, this may make it less memory intensive and further reduce CPU usage. Another possibility is to make it even more modular through configuring which parts to activate/disable (not just through permissions). Large packages are convenient, but with a plugin like MM, many features (especially when MM is required/installed only due to another plug in depending on it) aren't entirely used and seem to just be wasting resources.
    For example, based on my current usage, I only want the stations portion of MM, but that requires Core+Stations.
    I'd love to fully discover the potentials and usages of MM, but to be honest, there needs to be more examples of excellent usage of the plugin. Also, simpler instructions on how to quickly and effectively deploy the features of MM onto a server (simple examples of a working train network, farm, etc that allow new users to quickly learn and adapt to). This way, the next time someone starts planning for a new network of stations or is basically just starting a new world, they will be thinking of how to adapt those ideas with MM features. A great way to increase usage of MM (and to spread it more) would be to have a few features that really stand out from the rest and are practical in the majority of servers, though it would take some good planning and thinking to carry this out. Most server admins look for plugins that enhance or bring out new features that most people would likely use. It has to enhance gameplay without breaking original aspects of the game. It also has to be easily deployable, configurable, and generally speaking, lightweight.
    This and making its documentation/configuration even better would definately make it even more popular. Definately a good plugin today, but it has quite a bit more potential in it left. As I haven't really explored MM yet, what I say above might be extremely newbie-ish, I appologize in advance.
     
  21. Offline

    i542

    I actually used Minecart Mania on both single-player (when autocart died) and on hMod, while it was pretty much the only way to use minecarts the way they were meant to be used. Minecart Mania is - well, at least was - one of best plugins in the existance for both multiplayer and singleplayer.
    But then, we've moved over to bukkit, and Minecart Mania got lost somewhere. And, to be honest, we didn't had the need to use it, due to all /warp and /home commands. And then FalseBukkit came, and, for simplicity's sake, we used their mod because the configuration was simple or non-existent at all.
    If Minecart Mania's config becomes better than what I've heard, I will definitely use it on my server which I'm planning to start soon. Until then, I'm keeping the Minecart Mania thread in bookmarks and I check on it every once in a while.
     
  22. Offline

    OrtwinS

    I dont use it because it makes stuff too easy.

    Really awesome highly advanced stuff with a few blocks... nice... but it takes away the challange of building awesome highly advanced stuff using very simply puzzle pieces.

    The reason I like MC so much is the creativity, the playfield is pretty level since everyone can acquire ANY block in a few hours of play. The challange is in placing those 1 m^3 block just right to still be able to make detailed structures. And advanced systems.

    I admit, I use Craftbook mech and ICs, because I want a day/night sensor, its about the only block I use (and the random bit generator since yesterday). And I like moving gates. But I've even been thinking of removing the craftbook mech section to replace with those more realistic 'portacuilisse' (or what was the name) gates and bridges.

    I want to keep my server as vanilla as possible, plus some extra roleplay/advanced elements like gates/bridges, and making expierience count (mcMMO).
     
  23. Offline

    captainawesome7

    I don't use Minecart Mania because I never saw a need. We have all of falsebook, so I guess we use falsebook carts. I never really saw the point of switching to MM.
     
  24. Offline

    Killie01

    i use it on my 'having fun with shit' server
    but mainly i don't use it for the challenge of creating systems manually :)
     
  25. Offline

    devatrox

    We use it on our server but I would love to have a Minecart Mania Light which only adds empty Minecart detection to Detector Rails, change Powered Rails to start the carts without any block behind it, removes Mobs and items from the track and doesn't change the physics of how Minecarts work in general.

    We got used to the easy station setup with MM and I'm thankful for your plugin and your awesome support but using it still feels wrong somehow. Also Minecarts act different than in the vanilla game which prevents us from making any fun experiments which can be found on Youtube, because they just don't work with MM installed. We tried going back to vanilla for a week but that didn't work out well, because some stuff is really missing.

    Anyways, we're still using it and until something like above is released we will continue to use it. (don't like the new XML-config files though :D )
     
  26. Offline

    Sawn

    I'm really late to answer this topic but I'm thinking to set up Minecart Mania on my ~10+ server.

    Until now we had no use for it but we recently started to make some fun tracks.

    Two things comes to my mind that would definitively make me switch to MM :

    - Allow the conf to prevent the bug-fixed minecart-falling damage : we want to make our minecarts jump without being hurt :D
    (Did'nt saw that possibility on the wiki but I may have missed it, sorry if that's the case. I don't want to disable fall damage for anything.)
    - Allow the players to put tracks on glass because it would allow us to make nice sky tracks.
    (Again, did'nt saw it in the wiki)
     
  27. Offline

    JohnTheRipper

    I seem to be a little late to the conversation also, but here goes...

    I first started playing with your mods WAYYY back, in Oct/Nov 2010. Alpha was buggy, and autocart was fun for a while, and so was MM in SSP. Later, I started running a small hMod server, around November, and I really enjoyed it.

    Now, cut ahead several months. I hadn't been running servers for a while, and I decided to start again, at least as a testbed. What turned me away from MM at that point was that it consisted of a bunch of plugins-- the core, the addons, etc. Now I might be getting my dates confused, but that is what I remember.

    I simply abandoned it, and never looked back.

    I use FalseBook now, simply because it's in active development and reduces the amount of work needed to keep all the plugins up to date. I didn't even know that MM was still in active development!

    That's why I don't use it-- stability, reliability and speed all are problems with MM, and the reason I now use FalseBook.
     
  28. Offline

    BearFather

    When are server was on Hey0 are server really wanted this plugin, but I said no cause it take hey0 forever to update so we would run vanilla alot. And that would break out rail system that is only used when we were in vanilla. Now we don't update till bukkit is install cause we run multi worlds. But with the vanilla system I haven't even looked it for a while. I might check it out and see if it adds anything cool.
     
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