Why always ask money?

Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by spirroouu, Nov 3, 2011.

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  1. Offline

    luciddream

    What it really comes down to is this: Either a plugin developer wants to make a plugin or they want to get paid to make a plugin. If you make a request and the stars align and a developer wants to make that plugin then everything is just peachy, but far more likely is that no developer wants to make it for free. If no developer wants to program your idea but some developers are willing to do it for a price you can either pay the price, make it yourself, wait and hope someone does it later or give up. Complaining because nobody wants to work for you for free makes you look like an entitled child.

    The majority of plugins are free because the developer wanted to make the plugin and chose to give it away afterwards, nobody is sitting around going "Oh boy, I can't wait to brighten up someone's day by picking a plugin idea from a hat and programming it for someone else's benefit!"
     
  2. Offline

    V10lator

    @dxwarlock: I wanna make people happy with a server but I don't know how to set it up. I know you're busy spending much time to your own server, doing real-life paid work and such things but I need you. Oh, all the things you would do on my server would be exclusive, this is because I have some awesome ideas to handle support request and other things to make people happy, but they should be happy only on my server! Also the complicated configurations for the bukkit server, its plugins and all the other things like http should have many improvements I don't wanna see on other servers. It will take a few hours, maximum a few days to write all the complicated configs (you will have to write them from scratch because there are no default configs), test everything and bugfix it. So please spend your time for free to set my server up. If you don't you're a dick. And please be so nice to update the configs if anything breaks cause I update related software later.
     
  3. Offline

    dxwarlock

    V10later, that is a flawed argument trying to discredit my reasons for running a server for free, lets take one of your hobbies you enjoy..say its stamp collecting.
    Can I demand that I want to start doing it, you need to come do mine pasting, and labeling them for me, or you are a dick? You see? im busy with real life, and since you do your own for free..my stamps need you....

    I also like working on my car on the weekends, should i also soup yours up for free or I'm a dick? or maybe build you a china cabinet, since I enjoyed making my wife one...you need one too.

    you DO realize that your argument above is along the same lines of the original posters now..arguing against, what you was fighting for..
    You're saying "you made this for yourself, I want one free, or your a dick"...hence your NOW arguing "you make plugins for yourself for free, why should I pay?" in a way...its the same logic...stick to one side of the fence.
    I am confused, you agree that plugin devs, can charge for their work when doing it for others, that they like doing for own servers for free....yet demand I would do for others for free, what I like doing for my server....

    And i have helped many many users on mine, that asked for help without a clue how to set one up, and got them up and going. I do it because I like it..same reason I was a volunteer ARK in AO, hazmat in FE, and ticket support in NC, because I like the games..and wanted to give back to the community that makes it what it is.

    the debate of what I want to do with my money (host my own server) and me doing yours is COMPLETELY different that you are making out to be.
    If you want to charge for access, feel free, I never downed anyone for it. but for you to down me, and throw twisted strawman logic at me, in an attempt to somehow validate im wrong for hosting mine for free is strange.

    are you trying to tell me "you need to charge for access, or 'you are doing it wrong'"?
     
  4. Offline

    BlueMond416

    I would say it's not right to ask for money to make a plugin on bukkit because bukkit is meant to be free all the way. If you feel like you need to ask for money to do it than get a job as a coder! I make plugins on here for practice, to make others happy, and to get my name out there. ;) I also understand some people need to pay for things but companies won't take them in because they don't have a "degree" but don't harass the person for money.
     
  5. Offline

    V10lator

    But wait, you want plugin devs to make plugins for you for free ccause they make others for free, too...
    And should I make you a plugin for free just because I like programming?
    Yes, I do. Do you know why? I'm trying to hold you a mirror in front of your face and it seems to work...
    Yes, mirror... You start to get the logic we tried to tell you.
    And I'm active in the plugin development thread (helping other devs getting problems solved) and in the plugin request thread (picking up plugin ideas I like and doing them for free).
    Really? Writing configs is so much different in writing java code?
    Wait, now I'm confused... maybe I had taken you for somebody other, if so I'm sorry.
     
  6. Offline

    dxwarlock

    I think you might have me confused, re-read the thread, I never said that plugins should be free on all accounts..

    never once did I say its wrong to charge if someone wants something customized, or that even donations are in bad taste.
    I donate to every plugin I use that's vital to my server, and even got 1 that's a pay upfront (and defending his right to do so on this thread here) .

    I know how much work it takes to code, debug, and get it right, while customers complains about bugs you cant catch.

    My job is a application engineer for newspaper workflow software. (not bragging by any means, trust me its a 'code monkey' job at best) Just referencing I spend everyday fixing things that pop up as a small bugs to customers that demand "we need it done today!" and that cant understand, that I cant test every possible situation to catch them ALL in one day before first go-live deployment.
    So I know the value of their work, and their stress of admins going "PLZ UPDATE TO NEW BUILD I NEEEED IT!!" its why I donate to the ones I use that work well.

    I have no issues with plugins taking donations, or custom ones being applied a cost.Its a steadfast rule of the company I work for...you want our software, its got a basic fee, you want it to do something it does for no one else...you get a R&D development fee for the specialization.

    Hell if I needed one made for me, I'd insist the guy take something for his time, even if he wanted to do it for free..(which Ive been debating requesting, as java isn't my strongest language, and need one made for us beyond my level of bukkit knowledge)

    I just don't see how me hosting a server on my own cost, offends you so deeply..
     
  7. Offline

    V10lator

  8. Offline

    Zothen

    Wow, somebody is a genius at maths....:rolleyes:
    Go and play vanilla =)
     
  9. Offline

    andrewkm

    Why should anyone make plugins for free. Your post is ridiculous and stupid. This is my opinion and wont change. How about you go through the learning curve of making plugins, and create them for free ;) Its amazing how some users like yourself want things done with nothing in return.
    -
    I have paid a great deal of money to many of my plugin developers and I would do so again and again, as I do almost weekly for custom projects.
    -
    Edit/Ps: This thread you made is one of the most ignorant threads I've ever read. Seriously. Get your *** to my house and mow my lawn.
    Thanks.
    Show Spoiler

    Jello everyone. I have a simple question for ALL the people reading,
    Why, in gods name do we, the normal neighbours and town inhabitants have to pay for the mowing of a lawn?
    I asked today for a lawn mow and he asked 20$ the other one asked 40$ and usually when you ask for any landscaping that has to be done they want to be paid... Wich is ridiculous (this is my opinion, i ask your on what i say, no troll) why cant some people sacrify a little bit of their time to mow my damn lawn that everyone can look at and enjoy without asking money for it...
    Grass is beautiful, if you make every mow paid then how the fck do you want people to give money because they like your lawn... Anyways, it is a shame this planet is turning in the wrong way...
     
    tom likes this.
  10. Offline

    dxwarlock

    no worries :)
     
  11. Offline

    Cere4l

    I almost entirely agree with you, but please do not underestimate the time server admins on especially big server (not me :D) have to spend on making the game playable for everyone and maintaining it. I still remember the time i had to put in when my server hit 15 people... and really, what is 15 people?

    Other then that, I really agree, if nobody wants to make it for free, and youre too shabby to pay up... make it yourself
     
    undeadmach1ne likes this.
  12. Offline

    mindless728

    he is talking about the time spent in this community (Bukkit) not time spent running a server
     
  13. Offline

    jasvecht

    Better question:

    Why doesn't anyone develop a few professional plugins and puts a price tag on them?
     
  14. Offline

    Cere4l

    because.... serveradmins dont put time in for the community?
    I guess its true that everyone plays single player then, might aswell stop this entire bukkit nonsense if nobody uses it anyways
     
  15. Offline

    mindless728

    running a Bukkit server does not make you automatically a port of this community IMO, only if you contribute something. Seems as mostly dev's are the ones contributing to this community (yes we have some server admins that help people with setups and errors).
     
  16. Offline

    Cere4l

    Right, a server admin doesnt contribute to the community.... its not as if server admins allow others to play or something.
     
  17. Offline

    ZachBora

    Well you see those 2 bold things up there? They don't fit here. If someone asks for a specific plugin, usually not many people will use it.

    See that underlined thing up there? Forum rules state you cannot use an ad link.

    See those italic red words? They tell me you are probably an immature person (even if your profile says 21) and you probably think things in life should be free. Your parents or family probably give you all you need. But in real life it doesn't work this way. You take what people give you, you don't force them to give you something. Plugin developpers create plugins either because they need it themselves or because it sounds like a fun and/or useful idea and they want to share it.

    He's talking about the bukkit community. A server admin doesn't even need to create a bukkit account to setup his server with all his plugins.

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2016
  18. Offline

    Isocadia

    Really, I say that plugin's that ask twice the amount of money minecraft costs without giving twice the amount of fun, and you tell me to go play vanilla... I think you are suffering from the I D TEN T syndrome, cause that has to be the most useless, non constructive post I've ever seen.
     
  19. Offline

    Vhab

    You don't seem to understand the difference between a product sold to millions and a custom made product for 1 customer.
     
  20. Offline

    Isocadia

    I do, but that doesn't mean that I'm not allowed to think that 30 dollars is a bit much to ask for a plugin. I think that if one writes a plugin, they should give it to the community for app store like prices ( if they absolutely want the money and do not find donations enough ), if 1 server owner wants the right that only he's allowed to use the plugin, then ofc 30 dollars is ok, but not for a plugin that "anybody" can get ( anybody who's able to pay 30 dollars for a plugin ).

    Hmm, I'm just thinking, are we talking about a plugin being sold for 30 dollars, or somebody wanting 30 dollars to create the plugin for a server owner? If the second then I misunderstood the OP.

    Even after all of this, just telling me to go play vanilla, or in a major sarcastic way saying that I'm good at maths really is rude and just a plain sign of a heavy retardation.
     
  21. Offline

    Sleaker

    So you'd rather no plugins be open source - and have us charge a few dollars to anyone that wants to use our plugins? Because what's the point in charging a couple dollars if you can't limit distribution or sourcecode... MC isn't available to the community by paying notch 1 license.
     
  22. Offline

    spirroouu

    Sorry, no-one is paying anything for me. I am not very good at english and i sometimes make mistakes, i am not from a english country, sorry bout that, this is only my opinion. The asked and the other thing with evryone can use are said in a wrong way, sorry.
    Why then, on most plugins you have an ad link? And a normal download link

    That is why i am trying to make a plugin atm, a plugin like superheat. I do it all on my own and no, i wont start with a tnt blocking plugin, i am learning it

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 21, 2016
  23. Offline

    Isocadia

    Ofcourse not, what I meant was that people who create plugins and absolutely want money and do not find donations enough, should ask prices more in the app store range.

    *reread my post*

    Ok, I forgot to add that the app store prices were for people absolutly wanting the money, edited now.
     
  24. Offline

    Vhab

    The entire discussion is based around making custom plugins on demand for a specific server owner.
    30 dollars is not much at all for a single sale for a plugin tailored to the specific needs of a customer.
     
  25. Offline

    Isocadia

    Ah, then 30 dollars isn't that much, it's even quite a low pay, if creating the plugins takes more than 1-2 hours...
     
  26. Offline

    Cere4l

    neither does a plugin writer.... neither do the users, but theres still users on this forum aswell. we ARE part of the community and we DO put time into it.

    the community is all of us man, not just the few who are willing to code :-/
     
  27. Offline

    TomyLobo

    This is a very good idea :)
     
  28. Offline

    emericask8ur

    Because when you ask for a dev to do a project it takes away from their time and they might not be interested in the plugin. But usually i make plugins because its very fun and i like to make people happy with my work.
     
  29. Offline

    Waterflames

    A few notes:
    -A developer should get paid. Even for a free project, he should get paid in appreciation. Why else would we do this? We aren't robots :p
    -The community consists of both developers and users. These 2 are essential to make this work.
    -Paid plugins would give a number of effects. My guess if 3/4 of the plugins would become paid:
    • The number of programmers working on plugins would double.
    • The number of users would shrink depending on the price of paid plugins and availability of free alternatives.
    • If for example Spout would become paid, pirated versions would be all over the internet.
    • Anti-piracy would be build in, cracked and improved again. This is not what bukkit is about, we would be wasting valuable time.
    • The quality of top plugins would probably improve some.
    • Java plugins can still be decompiled.
    Personally, I think paid plugins aren't a solution. However, it wouldn't hurt if a system would be implemented in bukkitdev that allowed users to show appreciation to a dev with 1 click of a button. Right now, I mostly hear the bugs, request and questions. When I hear a "Great plugin" or something like that, it keeps me motivated.

    tl;dr:
    Replace paypal with thumbs up and make a Plugin Of The Day section.
     
  30. Offline

    M1sT3rM4n

    That's a subjective PoV. There are three ways to price goods: cost-based pricing, price-based costing, and competitive pricing.

    1. Cost based pricing: Price the good according to how much it costs for you to make (fixed costs + variable costs) and add a profit margin to be defined by the firm.

    2. Price-based costing: Price the good according to how much consumers are willing to pay.

    3. Competitive pricing: Price the good according to what your competition is charging.
     
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