More information on the Minecraft 1.7.2 update

Discussion in 'Bukkit News' started by EvilSeph, Nov 15, 2013.

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    EvilSeph Retired Staff

    Things are progressing nicely towards our first development build of CraftBukkit for Minecraft 1.7.2. Although this update did not provide or add as much feature-wise as previous Minecraft updates have, this is probably one of the more complicated and larger updates we've had to work with from a mod development standpoint. With "almost all of [the code in Minecraft] having been changed - be it little or big" (according to Mojang), there has been significant shifting around of code and logic - to the estimated tune of ~220k lines changed - within Minecraft, resulting in our slowest and most involved update yet.

    Managing expectations - information about our initial CraftBukkit 1.7.2 builds
    Five days ago (on November 10th) I sent out a tweet trying to describe what our initial findings were regarding the impact this Minecraft update has on the project but it's frustratingly very difficult to communicate everything I want or need to in 140 characters. Nonetheless, sending out tweets is still our best form of communication that doesn't push other important topics out of view (like the potential structure loss PSA).

    The tweet was meant to explain that while we will definitely have development builds, our analysis and evaluation of the update (through reading the code and following Minecraft feedback/bug reports from the community) has revealed that there are issues in Minecraft that may prevent us from getting anything stable or reliable out. This was purely meant to assist us with managing expectations as to the quality, stability and reliability of any builds we're able to give out.

    As for the 'issues we cannot fix' aspect of the tweet, this is due to the nature and policies of the Bukkit project: it is not so much that we are unable to fix the issues ourselves (though this can sometimes be the case), but rather that the issues present are not the project's responsibility to fix and, instead, would be better addressed by Mojang. While we do sometimes make exceptions if we have a really good reason to do so (like to fix a security issue), we try and avoid altering the way Minecraft itself behaves and functions. This is both a conscious decision as a project and a necessity, as too many changes to Minecraft's inner workings can mean significant increases in the complexity and amount of work required for the update process.

    It's not so much that we choose not to fix these issues, but rather that we need to be fully conscious and aware of the impact doing so could have on the update process and our day-to-day maintaining of the project. If the fix for an issue touches too many internals within Minecraft, for example, it usually makes the update process significantly more complex, resulting in (what could be an avoidable) increase in the amount of time it takes us to update. As much as we'd like to fix every issue we come across, doing so would mean updating to new Minecraft versions will take even longer than they currently do.

    This is why we have the minimal diffs policy (a policy which eliminates unnecessary changes to the Minecraft code), it results in a speedier and less buggy update for everyone. Although it undoubtedly limits the developers in our project, I think you'll agree that it's a worthy sacrifice and limit to impose upon ourselves in order to ensure that the downtime of your server between updates is as minimal as we can possibly achieve.

    If we were not personally responsible for updating the core of our project, we'd have much more freedom to experiment. As it is, however, the Bukkit project handles updating, development and the maintaining of both a plugin API (Bukkit) and a Minecraft server mod (CraftBukkit) in order to produce the server you all know and love.

    To be clear:
    • There WILL be development builds; we're still working towards getting our first one out.
    • Due to significant changes in how Minecraft works, it will take us a while to get our Bukkit API updated. Hence, it is highly unlikely that all the plugins you are using will work on our initial development builds.
    • There will MOST LIKELY be promoted builds, but they'll be lower quality than you could usually expect from us due to issues we can't address.
    What does updating CraftBukkit involve?
    To give you an idea as to why this update is taking longer than usual, I need to briefly touch on what our update process involves. Every time a Minecraft update is released, we have to go through a repetitive, time consuming and dry multi-step process.

    A simple breakdown of the process is as follows: decompile the server -> learn the new names (they change with every update) -> figure out how they apply to Bukkit's naming system -> learn what changed/what's new in the update -> update the changes we make to the server to support Bukkit -> get the code to compile -> fix issues that come up.

    Since we're working with a code base that is unfamiliar to us, we can sometimes find ourselves having to jump back to a previous step. For example: we may come across a piece of code that we're not familiar with and once we're able to figure out what it does, we realise that we've named something incorrectly which we then have to go back and fix. It is this fluid and unpredictable aspect of the update process that makes it difficult to come up with a communicable ETA or any progress/status updates.

    Though this process may seem inefficient or ineffective, this is the same process that we've used and improved upon to get all of our updates out (even our fastest ones) over the 3 years the project has existed. Bear in mind, the overview provided here barely touches the surface of our update process and is intended to give you a remote idea as to what we have to deal with for every update. This brief and simplified breakdown of our 'steps' does little to explain the varying level of difficulty or complexity of each step, for example.

    How can I help?
    The best way to help us out is to get involved.

    If you're a server admin: once we have our first development build out, we'd appreciate any testing you could perform and any issues you can report. Please bear in mind that development builds are unsupported and should not be run on production servers.

    If you're a plugin developer: once we have our first development build out with proper API support, we'd appreciate if you could test the build out and report any missing or broken API to our bug tracker.

    If you're looking to help us out with the update, you'll have to work towards that goal by getting involved in other aspects of the project first. Due to the sensitive and extremely team oriented nature of the update process, we require that you build a relationship and demonstrate your commitment to the project before getting involved with updating will benefit the process. As the update process is incredibly repetitive and mundane, intense commitment is a key requirement for the team.

    We know this update is taking longer than usual but I assure you we are working our hardest to get it done. Thanks for your patience and continued support, it makes a huge difference and really helps us push onward!
     
  2. Offline

    Bobcat00

    My impression is that he was hired to do the API, didn't produce it, and worked on other things instead. (Why would he be messing with stuff like zombie targeting distance and useless graphics effects if he was supposed to be working on the API?) Last month, Mojang hired two NEW people to work on the API. That says to me that nothing has been done towards the API.

    It's all a matter of priorities, and the API has not been high on their list, as Mojang sees Minecraft as a single-player game.

    Just my opinion.
     
  3. Offline

    xsmokingbenx

    I don't understand how Mojang can consider Minecraft as a single-player game... There is a lot of multiplayer servers, just see how many people are waiting for Bukkit 1.7.2 ...

    Hope that all these changes won't "kill" the beautiful multiplayer side of Minecraft :/
     
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    Rockstar04

    I don't think that's an opinion, its pretty clear by the fact that Mojang keeps pushing it back.
     
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    asofold

    I would not bet on producing things here :p - i rate it at least as probable that they figured they would have to refactor huge amounts of code to create a proper+maintainable API. Thus they might take in more people once the people desired to design the API have staked out a workable concept+direction. In fact one might see it the other way round, that some people proved fit and motivated for working on internals as well. After all Minecraft is still being developed further, and Mojang doesn't employ 30 people solely for Minecraft, so i assume they might just keep balancing things internally, somehow. So it probably is just about priorities after all :p.

    That's all just speculation, though.
     
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    barker

    While I agree it can be frustrating, be sure not to lose sight of the fact that you are making money off of a freely developed, distributed and supported addon to a non-subscription based game. As an income providing server owner myself, I feel that we are very lucky that this opportunity to make this possible even exists.
     
    Jemrada and markdf like this.
  7. It's already been explained/stated why no ETA is given, and the frustration is on their side as well.

    If you're losing players because of people wanting to play 1.7.2, then (unfortunately) there's not much else you can do, other than running a vanilla 1.7.2 server (eek?) ;-)
     
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    Bobcat00

    Which the vast majority of players are either unaware of or unwilling to use.
     
  9. Offline

    effortless

    "the update that changed the world"

    More like the update that screwed multiplayer.

    Taking bets that we'll see 1.7.3 before craftbukkit, or that it'll be released a couple days before. Any takers?

    Snapshots are out already
     
  10. Offline

    PunJedi



    Amateur! :) just razzin' ya. Of COURSE Mojang will do 1.7.3 before bukkit. I would even venture 1.7.5 might happen before dev is seen. Bukkit team is kicking butt. I'm not 'fanboying', I am just saying, I have a feeling we will see a craftbukkit 1.7.2 dev soon (week-ish) and then more builds pushing towards the 1.7.x later on.

    Keep in mind that no matter how many 1.7.x additions or bug fixes Mojang does, it stands to reason that once the bukkit team puts out a craftbukkit of any caliber, it will only be a few days afterwards that they need to address the more recent changes/additions/fixes. Translation - When Bukkit gets the major chunks of changes addressed, it shouldn't be much more to address the newest snapshot fixes.
     
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    RockCrafted

    Keep The Good Work Up!
     
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    server075

    28-Nov-2013 Minecraft releases 1.7.3
    Most likely Bukkit will not release there 1.7 update before this date as the changes in 1.7.3 will require more updates in the code. Will Bukkit provide a update before my server runs empty xD
     
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    MetalGearDaner


    1.7.2 and 1.7.3 are compatible versions
     
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    sackboy_lbp

    Good work guys! Can't wait for the dev build! Btw, what happened to bukkit.org/bukkit? its no longer there.
     
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    Baba43

    Hello,

    first thank you for your great and hard work!

    Is there any information out if it will take weeks or months?
     
  16. Offline

    mcwurth


    it took weeks already now it is just waiting to see the weeks go over in months.

    /sarcam

    they will not give an ETA as you can read in the very first post
     
  17. Offline

    Mitch229

    Thanks for the update , awaiting patiently
     
  18. Offline

    SamFutch101

    I love Bukkit!


    That would be so epic!
     
  19. Offline

    Bobcat00

    I donated US$25 to Bukkit yesterday.
     
    drtshock likes this.
  20. Offline

    MetalGearDaner

    Will donating make them to release the dev build faster?
     
  21. Offline

    turt2live Retired Staff

    Not necessarily. But considering the thousands of people who use Bukkit use it for free and make thousands off of it...

    It doesn't hurt to throw $10-$30 at the team.
     
    MarioG1 and drtshock like this.
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    Bobcat00

    Probably not. Does that make it wrong to donate? I'm not sure what you're saying.
     
  23. Offline

    mbcx2

    Skeleton and Zombie stuff he did when he was bored, the "Super Secret Settings" and "Twitch Integration" and "Depreciated Item IDs to minecraft:stone example" and tons of other stuff is for the Minecraft API, some stuff is just for fun and improving the game for helping jeb sometimes, but mostly for the Minecraft API
     
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    Reverof82

    Thanks for the great work guys, cant wait for the update!!
     
  25. Offline

    MetalGearDaner

    Just a question. Of course is good donating
     
  26. Offline

    codename_B

    Good luck! Hope the update is going smoothy.
     
  27. Offline

    Bouger

    The dev build will release this year or the next year?
     
  28. Offline

    turt2live Retired Staff

    That's just rude.
    The developers are working quite hard at it (most of those nights are damn near sleepless). On top of that the team isn't exactly happy that it's taken this long.
     
    timtower and coreymichealroy like this.
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    coreymichealroy

    There's really no ETA to when bukkit 1.7.2 will be ready. Sometimes they finish some coding then they find a bug and a bug within the bug. So you can't really put a date on when this will be finished.
     
    timtower likes this.
  30. Offline

    Rexel

    "Super Secret Settings" ie crappy effects when they still cant even get proper AntiAliasing as a graphics quality setting in the game.

    Infact 1.7 has now completely screwed the rendering for forcing AA via gfx card drivers, now get that shitty FXAA type of blur in game with it now. Morangs

    "Twitch Integration" garbage site with slow servers already, now about to get even more crap with kids streaming. And mojang are so crap its not like they implement the feature in a way that lets users record the screen to file, or even set there own streaming server.. no this is lock in to crappy twitch servers.

    "Depreciated Item IDs to minecraft:stone example"
    Makes a whole lot of sense writing out item names instead of just using numbers.. yeh I can just see this dumbificated mod api.

    "Mojang sees Minecraft as a single-player game."

    They see it as the proverbial cash cow that it is, keeping up the appearances for the twitt followers, doing crap updates, and breaking better mods and plugins that have done a FAAAAAAR better job of improving the singleplayer game and the game itself than mojang have, they have ZERO intention of making a decent singleplayer game its always been a joke.

    They just riding the wave of success while cashing in on the millions. If notch was even vaguely serious about wanting to improve minecraft as a game or take it to the next level he of gotten a bigger team to work on minecraft2, instead they drag everyone through there crapshot updates and laughable final updates that then need patching. The game doesn't get a break from mojangs fffing around, to the fools who think its mojang that keep this game interesting to deeer effing hell it is! Forget the multiplayer servers that all still use bukkit because there own vanilla server is like a moldy sponge compared to bukkit.
     
    ravand and MinecraftLegends_us like this.
  31. Offline

    Bobcat00

    Rexel, why don't you tell us how you really feel? :)
     
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