[Poll] Will you use Bukkit Plugin Studio? (for developers)

Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by Killie01, Dec 6, 2011.

?

Would u use?

  1. Yes

    32.4%
  2. No

    47.9%
  3. Maybe

    19.7%
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  1. Offline

    ZachBora

    I have a suggestion for your IDE (it might already be on your to do list or already coded i don't know).
    Make it so when you add events to a listener it automatically adds the if event.iscancelled return.
     
  2. Offline

    mindless728

    ahh, should stop posting after getting 3 hrs of sleep, my bad
     
  3. Offline

    Killie01

    :p
     
  4. Offline

    JeroenFM

    You asked us if we would use it, I'm just telling you why not, and what I would have chosen if facing the same problem.

    Also, I believe I also questioned the quality of the auto-generated code sample you provided, so I did have something new to add to the discussion
     
  5. Offline

    Killie01

    indeed you added something, but the quality is good, i've seen it in alot of good plugins.
     
  6. Offline

    JeroenFM

    Let me guess, you haven't read Clean Code by Robert C. Martin?

    Code that works is not necessarily quality code
     
  7. Offline

    xianthax

    Your prospective users are telling you its a terrible idea and that instead you should just build a plugin and your response is to get angry...

    You'll never develop anything successfully with an attitude like this. Whatever you do should be customer/user focused. If your just going to ignore your users and do whatever you want, then why did you bother even starting this thread?
     
  8. Offline

    Killie01

    im not getting angry, im getting annoyed, i told i don't know how many times, and i get the same message as response all the time, and it does piss me off a bit.

    that is not my attitude. that is people ignoring what i say, and repeating previous messages.
     
  9. Offline

    thehutch

    idk if anyone hear has ever talked to Killie, he has anger problems :D :D :D . Anway we are accepting all your feedback but it is frustrating reading messages which have already been posted and if I hear one more person say we are "reinventing the wheel" im going to shoot you after copying Nijikokun's comment one angry thread was more than enough :p

    However I personally think that we shouldn't make a plugin for eclipse because then we would have to write about 5 different plugins each for each IDE out there which to me seems even more stupid than writing a "simple" IDE also we will have features which won't be present in all IDE's like the synchronised team coding much like Saros from eclipse but isnt present on IDE's like NB,IntJELLY ( :p ) and some others which would increase the productivity of dev groups IMO.

    Also I would like to state that yes I am learning C# but you have to remember that Kyle/Aron and Mitch are all professional C# developers (Aron is going to learn C# professionally in the real world ) So do not think this is going to be a cheap-rip off and like I said before we (Aron) have bought developer tools (if you will) to make this project better which has cost some serious money.

    TL;DR I'm not complaining but don't repeat and ^^ contains some useful info on what this project will contain and produce
     
  10. Offline

    Jaker232

    I could use this. If you have a time, implement a feature that you can add other devs that register on this program and you can team up with them like live coding with a chatbox popout.
     
  11. Offline

    thehutch

    Thats exactly what the synchronised team coding is and we will have a site for devs to register to so they can get the lastest news from BPS, Bukkit (twitter feed and possibly RSS) and other minecraft related topics.

    Also one feature which we also plan on doing is something which most people hate (unless you use maven which a lot of people don't) will be auto-downloading/updating of your external jars which can be incredibly useful IMO basically this IDE will combine the best features of other IDE's which solely focuses on bukkit development.
     
  12. Offline

    Vhab

    We noticed.
    You might not want to put the guy with anger management problems in charge of PR :)
    Though, you were getting quite emotional yourself earlier in this thread.
    Maybe even more so than Killie. I ended up deciding it was inappropriate to continue pressing the matter while you were that upset.

    It's not really our business who's a professional or not. But there's no need to lie about it.
    If Aron is still learning, then certainly he's not a professional yet.
    Since you're mentioning real names, I don't know which name links to which profile, but at least 2 of the team members mentioned in the first post are at an age they still should be in school. Which leaves 1 of the 3 you mentioned that might actually have a job as c# programmer.
    Not that age matters, or whether you guys have a job as c# programmer matters, but why bring it up and lie about it?

    Actually, I haven't seen any post in this thread that questions the ability to program in this thread.
    The only thing that is being called out is the gigantic scope of the project and a path that by many is deemed inefficient and counter productive.
    It's not your programming skill that is being questioned here.


    Really though, get your team together and reconsider the way you all are presenting yourself on the forums.
    Throughout this threads you two have been repeatedly borderline-insulting several people who cared enough about your project to provide feedback.
    These people took time out of their lives to tell you and try to convince you of an approach they consider to be more benefiting for the community.
    All they're being rewarded with is being called rude, mean, annoying and explanations of how they supposedly piss you guys off, just because they stated their opinion.

    Dropping lines that sum up to "we spent money on this, we know what we're doing" doesn't help either. This forum is filled with developers with a wide range of skill.
    Some of the people who provided feedback will barely have gotten started, but several others may as well be industry professionals (I know a few of them are actually).
    There are many respectful ways of dealing with other people, like calmly explaining your motives or when you can't, simply not replying. Telling people to shut up is not how you should be addressing your potential users.

    Prove yourself through actions and proper behavior, not by pulling rank by supposedly being a group of professional programmers.
    That stuff just doesn't work on this crowd. You're always going to run into someone who outranks you in life and will be insulted by your attempt to pull rank.


    If you're all confident in your ability to create this project, why not open source it right now and let people see the progress that is being made?
    That should quiet down several people.
     
  13. Offline

    Killie01

    Where am i insulting people? If i did so, im sorry.
    im not telling people to shut up, im telling not to repeat one thing
    And it's source is on: https://www.assembla.com/code/bukkit-plugin-studio/subversion/nodes
    Cleaninh will be done, code is added for testing too, so some code is temporary.
     
  14. Offline

    mbaxter ʇıʞʞnq ɐ sɐɥ ı Retired Staff

    What is your current development schedule for this? When can we expect...
    a) The basics (editor, compiling, jar building)
    b) Intellisense-like suggestions
    c) Code navigation (eg eclipse "open declaration," "call hierarchy" etc)
    d) plugin.yml generation
    e) automatic inclusion of bukkit javadocs
     
  15. Offline

    Killie01

    will be added.

    Why you dont see any commits form lately:
    i gave the wrong repo url :/
    let me setup a github page
     
  16. Offline

    mbaxter ʇıʞʞnq ɐ sɐɥ ı Retired Staff

    I didn't ask "can we expect" but rather "when can we expect" these features. I'm curious what your timeline is.
     
  17. Offline

    Killie01

    well, im not sure, we're hoping 2 -3 months, to get a beta with working features stated above.
     
  18. Offline

    ChrizC

    [​IMG]
     
    hatstand likes this.
  19. Offline

    ZachBora

    @ChrizC except they aren't aiming at one universal standard, just something with less features.
     
  20. Offline

    hatstand

    Will I use it? No, I'm comfortable with Eclipse.
     
  21. Offline

    ChrizC

    It's still fairly relevant. They're trying to create a use case for everyone who writes Bukkit plugins, pulling them away from Eclipse, NetBeans and IntelliJ.
     
  22. Offline

    Killie01

    who! stop right there! we wont pull people away from eclipse/intellij/netbeans
    we want NEW developers, and people who want to, to use this application, if you like eclipse more, stay there.

    EDIT: this means i'm not really trying to compete.

    https://github.com/killie01/Plugin-Studio/tree/master/BPS <--- REPO

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 22, 2016
  23. Offline

    mindless728

    don't forget the people who use a text editor and compile using javac and package with the jar command

    EDIT: to save a double post

    no this means you are still competing, just not for existing user, but for new users

    IMO im with a lot of people, you should develop this as a plugin for one of the other IDE's, you don't have to do all of them, just pick one at first get it feature complete then work on another if you want

    writing a whole IDE is just insane (IMO) for what you probably want to accomplish, not to mention wasting time on things that have already been done. The only way i can see the IDE being a good idea is if NONT of the IDE's have the api to do what you want
     
  24. Offline

    Killie01

    if nobody would take time on something that already existed, there would just be one choice for one type of software.
    people need choices, so we make a new choice.
     
  25. Offline

    mindless728

    except in your case there are 3-4 (that i know of) major players for java IDE's and oodles of ones that hardly anyone else uses, so the choice is already there

    what you guys seem to want to accomplish could quite handily be done by modding an existing IDE (with plugins), but you have decided to go overboard and make an entirely new IDE

    and if this is your reasoning for creating the IDE, i don't think this is a good reason for that

    another note, how are you going to get people to use the IDE since you cater specifically to bukkit, what i mean by this is that when people are asking for help on starting bukkit development i don't think people here will point them to your IDE, they will point them to NetBeans or Eclipse as that is what people currently use, and you are not trying to convert them to your IDE

    just some thoughts
     
  26. Offline

    petteyg359

    Just because you've moved the "dirty" code from one class to another doesn't mean it isn't still there. All you've done is added additional code and doing X in Y lines is probably slower than doing X in Y-1 lines.
     
    Killie01 likes this.
  27. Offline

    Killie01

    indeed

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 22, 2016
  28. Offline

    JeroenFM

    I'm not moving the dirty code anywhere, I'm eliminating it altogether. I have no if-statements to distinguish between commands anywhere. And having a plugin do an action in 12 nanoseconds rather than 10 nanoseconds is an acceptable sacrifice when it comes to readability and maintainability.

    What do you think is easier to read for other developers (or for that matter, yourself if you haven't looked at it in months)? A 400 line method (probably as part of your main plugin class, judging by what I often encounter on Github) that handles 10 different commands, or a 12 line method that handles just 1, contained in a class dedicated to just that command?
     
  29. Offline

    Killie01

    you must know i placed it there as an example...
     
  30. Offline

    JeroenFM

    Sorry, what are you referring to?
     
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