[ ON HOLD] GROUPMANAGER+ - PermissionsBukkit Manager

Discussion in 'Plugin Development' started by Mrchasez, Aug 21, 2011.

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    Essentials Post Where New GroupManager Will be:

    Old Post:
    Show Spoiler
    Show Spoiler

    The SuperPerms Manager.

    Purpose of the plugin:
    GroupManager was a great plugin and unfortunately Anjo had to leave his city for work.
    When i used to talk to anjo a lot, He was a really nice guy and was straight with people.
    He made one of the best Group Managing plugins ever, and we didn't plan to work on it, recenlty it stopped working with new bukkit builds, and is no longer compatible with lots of plugins.
    We decided to fix it up, and add/ change some things to make it even better.
    This will be GM in a BukkitPermisisons/ SuperPerms skin, It will function and act like GM but support SuperPerms 100%. The Users and Groups.yml will become Config.yml and this will work under SuperPerms Permissions style
    Command.Command: true

    Advantages Over Permissions
    • User multigroup support.
    • Simple In game Commands.
    • Now compatible with iChat, HeroChat, mChat, (recommended) EssentialsChat
    • Same easy feel as before

    New Features:
    • Multiworld is now an Auto feature
    • Auto Saves
    • Now have an option to run back ups, time based.

    Will i have to change my files?
    • Short answer, no
    You will only need to change the .Jar to the new one
    • What will i have to change?
    Nothing, Any files that you have, (which are no longer used in this version) will be ignored and you don't necessarily need to remove.

    Does this work with previous Bukkit Builds?
    • It will work with most previous Bukkit Builds

    Will permissions format change?
    • Maybe.
    We aren't sure if we will keep the exact same format, or change it to mimic BukkitPermissions
    • Is this Compatible with Permissions/ BukkitPermissions?
    Yes, It is compatible with PermissionsBukkit/ SuperPerms

    Prefixes and Suffixes?
    • Unlike before, When you just added '&()'
    for a Prefix or Suffix, You will now need another plugin for it.
    • What Plugin should we use for Prefixes and Suffixes?
    EssentialsChat is what its set up to use.
    Although, iChat or most others are now supported.

    • This supports SuperPerms?
    Yes, This will have the GroupManager feel and accessiblity, but supporting
    SuperPerms 100%.

    Leave a post for any other information, We are looking for ideas to put in.
    If you have any suggestions or questions please leave them.
    Their is not a release date yet, Although it is close.
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    any eta
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    We are finishing code now, and it will head to testing and support.
    Should be within five days.
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    mbaxter ʇıʞʞnq ɐ sɐɥ ı

    Just to be clear:

    Does this work with the built-in permission system or the old, outdated 'permissions'-style systems? The post didn't seem clear to me.
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    Will use the "Old" style of Permissions.
    We don't want to use the BukkitPermissions style of:
    command.command: false

    If we do switch over we would need to lose "*" node
    which we don't want to do at this time.
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    Yay, i don't like the new bukkitpermissions i much prefer groupmanager. Mainly because bukkitpermissions made a lot of permission plugin developers abandon their work.
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    This will be the same feel as GM.
    We already have this running on my server, and its working good.
    All the bugs from GM are no longer an issue with GM+
    Hopefully we can release soon.
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    mbaxter ʇıʞʞnq ɐ sɐɥ ı

    Ah, that's because with the new system, the * node is the responsibility of the plugin developer if they want to include it. I've personally never understood the point of the * node. With proper group management, adding a dozen or two permissions takes only a few minutes and is a one-time affair.

    I would strongly recommend supporting the new system, as that's the direction plugins are going to move. Starting out without superperms support puts you behind other plugins from the moment you release.
    Daniel Heppner likes this.
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    As said in the post, We are looking to Mimic them.
    Not use the exact same thing, We want to be able to use both, SuperPerms style and old
    permissions style, But we are dumbfounded on how to right now.

    I don't think most plugins will leave Permissions style,
    I know the "*" node isn't that important, and we will probably change it out sooner or later.
    Supporting SuperPerms is on our check list for sure though.
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    Daniel Heppner


    I don't think you guys understand how the new permissions works without the * node. It's much better. Do some more research before jumping to conclusions.

    If you don't know how to use SuperPerms, I'd suggest learning how instead of writing a whole plugin.

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2016
    mbaxter likes this.
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    Its not that we don't know how, We just want to be able to support them both, while the majority is still Permissions and not SuperPerms.
    When the time comes we will change Groups and Users.yml into a SuperPerm compatible file.
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    Daniel Heppner

    The time to support SuperPerms is now. Don't make it hard to phase out old systems. Don't encourage the use of old systems. Seriously.

    Look at it like this: Bukkit has all the code for a good permissions system, and instead, you're going to write your own that probably won't even be as well coded, even if it is easier to understand for some people. Reinventing the wheel is stutid.
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    If we switch over to SuperPerms, Wouldn't it be SuperPermsManager not GM+?
    The majority is with Permissions style, We won't switch over to a type of permissions which isn't widely supported yet. We personally like the old version better, even if its less practical.
    We aren't reinventing the wheel, we are staying with it.
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    Daniel Heppner

    There's a new type of wheel that's better, but it's not widely supported yet because of people like you.
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    We plan to intergrate SuperPerms.
    Just not this second, Ok.
    Thank you very much for your input :)
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    mbaxter ʇıʞʞnq ɐ sɐɥ ı

    You can easily have group management, thus GroupManager+, and still support superperms :)

    Good luck with the plugin.
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    How so?
    What do you mean?

    Will be a SuperPerms Manager.
    It will have GM feel, and work like GM but support SuperPerms.
    Groups and Users will be set up PermissionsBukkit style.
    This will delay the release a little.

    This isnt recreating the wheel, this is adding a new one.
    Their are lots of permissions plugins, but very few PermissionsBukkit Managers, if any.
    This will be a totally new plugin.

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2016
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    All you do is force people to rate your server that is why you are one of the highest rated server. I dont see other server doing this. So what if it is the largest cracked server, it is also one of the lousy server I have been to.
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    This is the new system, and i made over 2,700+ people take the time to register and play on my server?
    Im amazing!

    Ok, you make me lol.
    This is the PermissionsBukkit system.
    U mad Bro?

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2016
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    Implying the bukkit permissions system isn't doing this in a greater level by stripping out a huge amount of features that the existing plugins provide, and requiring a 3rd party plugin to create an easy to manage system for server owners.
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    Well i am sure the new permissions system is great but for now i think a lot of people just want to stick to group manager or their other permissions plugins that they are used to. I see no reason why he should abandon this either... But if there is a specific reason please state it :)
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    Explain to me why plugin developers abandoned their work because of new permissions system?
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    I see where you are coming from but i don't see why we can't continue to use group manager for the people that prefer it. Anyway if BukkitPermissions is as good as you say then this plugin's use should have no effect because it will be "inferior" as you are trying to state. BTW i have nothing against plugin standards changing i just would like for plugin developers to continue and not just go inactive because bukkit incorporated their feature.
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    This will still work on them both.
    The release is just a little delayed now.
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    The moderators on this forum must have gotten over their power trips or something. I've gotten infractions for asking questions before on this forum, let alone act near as out of line as the people on the first page.

    Good luck with your plugin, Mrchasez. If people don't like it, they should fuck off and just use whatever plugin they support. I am neither for or against this plugin - but I think you should be allowed to release whatever you want to without retards posting in big colored fonts about how they oppose the idea. It's permissions for Minecraft.
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    I can only speak for myself as a plugin developer, but I hope other devs feel the same way...

    My plugins currently support Permissions 2.7.4 & 3.1.6, as well as Bukkit's superperms. Permissions (2.x/3.x) is on the way out, and I won't support it forever - sooner or later I'll drop support for Permissions. I will support superperms forever. And I will never add support for any other permissions API to my plugins.

    What this means: if your permissions plugin implements superperms, my plugins will support your permissions plugin, via the built-in player.hasPermission() API. If your plugins doesn't support superperms, my plugin will never work with your permissions implementation.

    (And that applies to all existing and potential new permissions plugins, not just this one).
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    Just so you know...this can either go two directions.

    All plugins use SuperPerms, have it easy, but people are bitching about the syntax. I end up making a SuperPerms editor tool so you can manage it easier, maybe even add a * option in it which 'simulates' this. Everyone is happy.

    All plugins have to support 1-10 permission plugins AND the super permissions, ending up with what I had to do: Write my own 'Permissions.java' class file that combines all permission types into one accessible class. Everyone has to make the same class, use it in every plugin, and has to make it compatible with future newcomers for the sake of people demanding it.

    I rather go with the first one, simply, because it IS powerful, and any thing lacking in the syntax can be added using third party software.
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    You sound a lot like one of those 'types of players' who was banned for doing something incredibly stupid, and is now back to try and torment the guy running the server. Go away.

    @ All the people hopping on the bandwagon of hate
    You also need to go away. A lot more people still use the old permissions systems over BukkitPerms than you seem to think. I feel like a lot of developers are trying to vigorously defend this new system, when the fact is that its more of a hassle to use. You claim that its 'built in now', yet you still need a 3rd party plugin to have any functionality. How is this any different than the old? We're all entitled to our own damn opinions, so stop shoving your ideals down this guy's throat. Just agree to disagree, and move on.

    Good luck with your work. As many have said (some a bit more arrogantly than others), this should contain support for BukkitPerms. If you choose not to, that's completely your choice, and we have no say in what you do.
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    The big difference is for plugin developers: with superperms, I need to make one check in my plugins - player.hasPermission() - and I know that my plugin will work with any superperms-supporting permissions plugin. No more need to add support for 4 or 5 different plugins - a single built-in API call and I'm done. (Apart from the fact that I still support Permissions 2/3 in a legacy mode, but that won't last forever).

    Server admins are free to choose whatever implementation they like best (assuming it actually supports superperms, which Permissions does not and I suspect never will - but Permissions appears to be moribund anyway).

    And players need never know the difference.

    I'm really not sure how it's any more of a hassle to use, apart from a one-time migration for server admins, depending on what plugin they already use. I was pretty sceptical of superperms initially too, but I blame that on the fact that the concept wasn't particularly well communicated at release time. Now I've come to understand it, I think it's definitely the way forward. I'm glad @Mrchasez has come round to the idea of supporting superperms with this GroupManager rework - not doing so would have been a seriously bad decision.

    Well, you can, but if this plugin doesn't work with superperms, I think you'll find a lot of plugins simply won't support it. Making its use severely limited.
    Celeixen likes this.
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    We need an 'onPlayerHasPermission' event in the PlayerListener. It would solve SO MANY DAMN THINGS!
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