[IDEOLOGICAL REQUEST] Please Release all Plugins Publically and Under an Open License [FORMATTED]

Discussion in 'Archived: Plugin Requests' started by Atomic Fusion, Dec 30, 2011.

  1. Offline

    Atomic Fusion

    Category: Ideological Request

    Name: Public and Open Source Plugin Development Pledge

    Personal Info: I started plugin development two days ago, developed three (extremely simple) plugins, and I am already very disappointed by the closed nature of some of the plugin development.

    What I want: If people would pledge to publicly release plugins under an open license that they develop for requests, I would be very pleased.

    Rationale: I would guess that almost everyone here uses other, public, open source plugins, and especially Bukkit. Many people have put much time into creating these softwares, and why not live by the golden rule? It's one thing to not release a plugin developed for one's self, but PMing a plugin to someone takes just as much effort as posting it here. The only reason that I can see for a requestor to not want a plugin releaesed publicly is that they payed to have it developed, but hey, they had something custom tailored for their situation, and they're using the public and open source Bukkit. One may think that their plugin would not be useful to anyone else, but if it's open source, making it useful is easy.

    I pledge to not fulfill private plugin requests and publicly release plugins under an open license (I like the Zlib), and you should too.
     
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    immac636

    If you request for a plugin developer to release his source code, then it must be granted according to bukkit's license, afaik.
     
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    Wolfy9247

    Although I'm not sure if this is the correct discussion forum for this matter, I will put in my two cents and say that I fully agree with your opinion. There's plenty of open source licenses that many plugin developers could release their code under that I think would fit just about any need. I, personally, like the RPL (Reciprocal Public License) over the GPL (General Public License) which most developers seem to license under. And yes, this is a side conversation on this as they're both open source licenses, just one has less restrictions as to what you're able to do with the code.

    tl;dr I agree.
     
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    Atomic Fusion

    Heh, I was trying to imitate that formatting request thread, but you're probably right that it's not the right place. i think that I accidentally put too much emphasis on the open source portion. It would seem to me that immac is right, as long as a plugin constitutes a derivative work of Bukkit.
    What I really meant to emphasis was the releasing of plugins at all. It really bothers me when people request that the plugin being developed for them is kept private.
     
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    Wolfy9247

    I like both the arguments, but I think it'd be good to try and put both together. It's one thing for them to release the plugin, another to make it open source. However, I do support doing both and I can only see more positives than negatives that arise from doing so in my honest opinion.
     
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    Atomic Fusion

    I like the Zlib, because it's really open, but actually the RPL is interesting. Thank you for pointing it out to me.
     
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    lmc

    I support open source, nd that's why my plugin is semi-open source. However try developing a plugin with hundreds of your own personal time put into it, I'm sure your views will change.
     
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    mindless728

    I'll send a request back at you

    Category: Ideological Request

    Name: Users to read documentation and learn how to configure plugins

    Personal Info: Being a former developer for this community, I felt that too many people did not even bother reading the documentation and failing that feel like learning how to configure plugins that are created for them for free

    What I want: Users to actually read documentation, learn how to configure a plugin, and gasp......possibly even just mess around with it to get it to work right

    Rationale: Bukkit has lost quite a few decent developers, especially as of late, and I feel it is because the user base on bukkit has gotten worse over time. This lowered user base seems to think they can bitch when a plugin is ever so slightly borken (not even giving details on what went wrong) and demand a fix.

    So until this ^ happens, i could give 2 shits about this tbh, if i release code i may even obfuscate it just for shits an giggles,
     
  9. Offline

    Atomic Fusion

    Perhaps they would, but plenty or people have had their views not change. Linux kernel?
    I've certainly had to help a few idiots, but it feels like your "punishing" the wrong people. The idiots will probably not care about your source.
     
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    Afforess

    Bukkit is GPL so you can legally require any and all plugin devs to give you their clean source code, under the GPL license.

    I'd encourage you to too, anyone not releasing their plugins as GPL is breaking international law. ;)
     
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    Atomic Fusion

    Which unfortunately doesn't solve the issue of people not releasing their work at all. Maybe Bukkit could be put under the RPL!
     
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    Afforess

    Use the DMCA to your advantage. You can force them to take down plugins unless they release the source.
     
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    mindless728

    yeah going after the developers who essentially make your community would be a good idea, not to mention linking against CraftBukkit means you only have to live up to the LGPL, which wouldn't be upheld as they release Notch code inside of the library.

    At a certain point you stop caring, i hit that months ago with most of the users of this site

    yeah good luck enforcing that
     
  14. Offline

    Atomic Fusion

    @mindless728 I'm surprised that you haven't given up on the world in general. Plenty of awful stuff happens. Surely you don't believe that everyone in the world are bad just because some are?
    You can always get around the GPL. Make an open source stub plugin that communicates over sockets with a close source program. Even the LGPL requires source, and I was under the impression that almost everything is linked against Bukkit. Besides, aren't most heavily used plugins open source anyway? Going after small infringers might not cause much of a ruckus.
     
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    Afforess

    Notch code is permissible in libraries, as it remains copyright Mojang AB while CB code is LGPL.

    See: http://www.minecraft.net/terms

    Linking off of CB does not fix the GPL issue, events for instance, are all in Bukkit.
     
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    mindless728

    I haven't given up on the world but I have this thought process that
    1) Everyone is retarded until proven otherwise
    2) Everyone is an asshole until proven otherwise

    been working out well for me so far

    thats true, but its a bit more work, the easier method is exactly what i said, since they can't actually use the LGPL on the CraftBukkit binary (because they its not there code) you don't even realistically worry about it

    and on the note of the RPL, you wouldn't be able to enforce people who run servers and have custom plugins because they can hide the plugins they have
     
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    Atomic Fusion

    But it would stop the "and don't release the plugin when you make it, PM it to me" crap on these forums that prompted me to post this at all. :D
    But obviously it's not going to happen.
     
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    mindless728

    actually that really wouldn't help as someone could just link there email then talk there
     
  19. Offline

    Atomic Fusion

    But I've seen people do the PM thing (as they request a developer in these forums).
    Then I can be a douche an issue them a "DMCA Upload Notification". Or something.
     
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    mindless728

    they can try, but that isn't going to stop it if the user already downloaded it, and once that happens it no longer matters

    fair enough, but i don't see them ever trying to enforce it, and if/when they do i see some people leaving

    btw i know this really isn't the place, but are you going to enforce the GPL on the Spout software?
     
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    Afforess

    Spout is not GPL.
     
  22. Offline

    Atomic Fusion

    What is it?
    Just kidding, why would I ask that? I can look it up. Sorry.
     

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