Question Download?

Discussion in 'Bukkit Help' started by sketchyt, Aug 4, 2016.

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  1. Offline

    sketchyt

    Sorry about this probably stupid question to some people. But where can I download, on the wiki it said that I can't download because of a DMCA takedown but how did everyone else get it?
     
  2. Online

    timtower Moderator Moderator

    @sketchyt Wiki also gives an alternative method to get it, requires some searching for yourself though.
    Buildtools by Spigot
     
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    Necrodoom_V2

    @sketchyt You cannot download it legally. dont bother with timtower, as the so called 'buildtools' is not a legal download in any way nor it even provides any official copy of Bukkit.
     
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    Rayzr522

    @Necrodoom_V2 ... :confused:

    EDIT: Where do you get your information?!?!
     
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    AlvinB

    @Rayzr522
    BuildTools is a bit of a disputed matter. The whole thing is caused by the fact that CraftBukkit's original license was invalid, because it contained Mojang's code. Wolverness (A former CraftBukkit developer) used the fact that the license was invalid and issued a takedown of CraftBukkit for all of his code contained with it. And he was completely within his rights to do so.

    But then, Spigot comes along and makes this process of BuildTools, where they compile the jars on the computers of the users, using patch files, and they claim that this makes the license valid again, since technically the code does not contain Mojang's work. Wolverness then issued a DMCA takedown to Spigot aswell, but they have not complied, and this is where we are at.

    I wouldn't defiantly say anyone is right here, both sides seem to have evidence against them. There also have been no statements by lawyers on this matter (that I can find) so no one really knows who is doing the right thing.

    I do however think that @Necrodoom_V2's statements are a bit unnecessary, the OP was asking how everyone else got the CraftBukkit builds, not if they are legal or not.
     
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    bwfcwalshy Retired Staff

    Not true, they did take their downloads down and made an alternative that is fully legal just shady. You can check for yourself, it is legal, Spigot and Mojang are fine with this work around.
     
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    Rayzr522

    @AlvinB @Necrodoom_V2 I believe they are legal. I think the original problem was that they were redistributing code that they really shouldn't have, but now they're not. BuildTools downloads it legitimately off of Mojang's servers, and then meshes it together into one big jar. I don't believe there's anything illegal about that.

    I don't know a whole lot about Wolverness or what he did, only that they were redistributing Mojang's code, which was not legal.
     
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    AlvinB

  9. Offline

    Rayzr522

    @AlvinB well he is being kind of a jerk, isn't he? Honestly I'm pretty sure it's fully legal, and if it wasn't I think it would've been taken down quite a while ago.
     
  10. Offline

    AlvinB

    @Rayzr522
    That's the thing, I have yet to find any definitive evidence that BuildTools is legal, but I have also yet to find any definitive evidence indicating that it isn't. If you have some material supporting BuildTools, I'd be happy to see it.
     
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    Rayzr522

    @AlvinB
    I'd be happy to have some material supporting it. I don't. I just am guessing that it is due to the fact that it is ONLY redistributing their code, which they (obviously) have full rights to considering that they wrote it.

    If I ever find definitive evidence one way or the other I'll let you know :)
     
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    AlvinB

    @Rayzr522
    The thing is - they don't. Spigot has essentially taken CraftBukkit's code, which Wolverness contributed a lot to.

    From what I understand, Wolverness has rights to his code of course, and can take it down as he pleases. But, CraftBukkit was licensed under a license that said that he couldn't. However, this license was invalidated because CraftBukkit contained Mojang code.

    Spigot attempts to revalidate said license by "patching" the Mojang source code with CraftBukkit/Spigot code. So the question is, Is the license revalidated? Can licenses even be re-validated? I don't know. And I bet the only way to know for sure is to have a lawyer have a say in the matter.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2016
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    Rayzr522

    @AlvinB
    The real question is how long until my brain implodes from trying to understand that paragraph? My estimate is between 3.14 and 42 seconds... you better back up! :p

    What exactly did Wolverness do? I don't think I ever understood that part quite right. Am I correct in saying that he suddenly just said "Hey, you can't use my code anymore!"?
     
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    AlvinB

    @Rayzr522
    Basically, I don't know fully why Wolverness decided that, but from what I have read is that it is something about, he got annoyed because Bukkit had (more or less secretly) been owned for Mojang for years, so he had essentially been working for Mojang without knowing.
     
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    Rayzr522

    @AlvinB
    Ah, so he just decided to copyright all his code? I know copyright isn't the right word but I'm sure you know what I mean...
     
  16. Offline

    AlvinB

    @Rayzr522
    Well, his code was copyrighted all along. Copyright allows authors to have a say in what happens to their works, unless there is a document (say a license) preventing them from doing certain things. CraftBukkit's license was never valid, so Wolverness could use his copyright if he wanted to, and the fact that Mojang owned Bukkit made him do it.
     
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    Rayzr522

    @AlvinB
    Well then it sounds like it isn't legal...
    And I doubt they can just replace Wolverness's code. That would be same serious work that they'd have to do over, but maybe while they're at it they could add in an NBT API ;)

    Anyways, yes, I agree, the question now is whether the license is valid or not.

    In the mean time you can use BuildTools and I don't think that's going to change anytime soon. I hope that Bukkit doesn't die, although I've always wanted to write my own alternative... I guess I'll just have to add that to my bukkit list (wink wink)
     
  18. Offline

    AlvinB

  19. Offline

    Necrodoom_V2

    @Rayzr522 I got the information by talking with Bukkit staff, Mojang and reading all posts related to it.


    @bwfcwalshy Of course spigot is fine with their own 'workaround'. that doesnt make it any legal.

    spigot received a DMCA for their buildtools, and in response they moved to a safe haven website.

    OP deserves to know that he is misled to download illegal builds that are not at all official or legitimate, and spigot does not belong to Bukkit forums, following their rapid actions against Bukkit and the Bukkit team, and Curse trying to offhandedly refer to illegitimate downloads is downright insulting to everything this project has stood for.
     
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    Rayzr522

    @Necrodoom_V2
    Sorry, I didn't know quite everything about the situation. Apparently @AlvinB is much more aware of what's actually going on than I am.

    I'm not entirely sure that it's illegal, but I will admit it sounds like it.
    However I don't think that you're server's going to get taken down because you're using a Spigot build or something like that, so you can still use the Spigot jars. It's not officially Bukkit, but it works. You won't (shouldn't) get in trouble for using it.
     
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    AlvinB

    @Necrodoom_V2
    I have no problem with you making the OP aware of a problem. But, you say it like it is so set in stone that this is absolutely true, when in reality the evidence supporting both sides is not definitive at all, especially to the regular non-law educated user.

    I'm not saying you are wrong. And I'm not saying you are right. All I'm saying is that the situation is unclear, and the OP deserves to know that it is unclear.
     
  22. Offline

    Rayzr522

    That isn't a reason not to code my own. I have nothing else to do :p
     
  23. Online

    timtower Moderator Moderator

    Locked.
     
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