dl.bukkit.org - 451 Unavailable for Legal Reasons?

Discussion in 'Bukkit Discussion' started by extended_clip, Sep 3, 2014.

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  1. Offline

    asofold

    Thanks for stating - answer: nope.
     
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  2. Offline

    TheRealZillo


    Okay, if you seriously thought me or anyone else was planning a real lynch mob against someone, then good god, I weep for you. You're already on the decline of your mental stability. Go see a doctor, or hit yourself in the head with a hammer. Either one works. You're not above me in morality, personality or maturity, so get out of here with that.
     
  3. Offline

    Necrodoom

    TheRealZillo I don't see how threating someone's life is a joke.
     
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  4. Offline

    krisdestruction

    TheRealZillo Look, there's no point of empty threats. You say you're 26, meaning you are slightly older than me. Act your age.
     
  5. Offline

    TheRealZillo


    You know you want to. Quit frontin'.


    Educate me on someone should act at my age, har har har. We define our ownselves. So, no, actually don't educate me on your outdated definition on how I should act. You will NOT govern me in any type of way.


    Refer to my first reply to you, chump.

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 10, 2016
  6. Offline

    krisdestruction

    You mention how you're probably older than Necrodoom, yet you don't act maturely. Age implies maturity and experience. If you don't agree with that, your age was irrelevant to bring up in the first place in your post.
     
  7. Offline

    Necrodoom

    Acting on outdated and wrong "freedom of speech", aren't you? It ends when you violate someone else's right, such as the right to live.
     
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  8. Offline

    asofold

    I have to shorten what i write on "free market":
    a) All you have is "it compiles". An interesting measure is the "kill count during installation", without letting the excuse count that the admin was incompetent.
    b) I'm out at this point of that topic. You may call my perspective "not scientific (yet)".
    No doubt it's great, but there was lots of problems too, partly seemingly related to the actions that happen now. They probably did their best, but i had hoped for a more flexible decision taking, also thinking of the possibility to include more people and methods to improve things. That could all be irrelevant, if the law stuff turns shows that it could never have lived anyway :(.
    What stance? I'm still looking for one. The problem is that he wants to protect the GPL, and that he might be allowed to protect anything else but the CB / Bukkit code staying open source. The nature of the GPL is doubtable for this kind of modding project, also because the Bukkit team did not post their intent on shutting it down if XYZ happens, especially having the plugin API in mind. Effectively they betray plugin developers and server owners by not having a clear statement on that - not only their fault, but it's a big point to consider for the future: "where are we heading and where not" ~ i might've overlooked such statements in the wiki maybe? Of course it has to be at court, unless Mojang ceases to try to rescue Bukkit for the moment. With roughly 180 (?) past contributors, this case should be 100% checked, there is hardly a way around it, unless they find some way to cover 90 % of the code with idk asking+money+automating-tools in no time, so the risk of reiterating this is minimal.
    Both to blame somehow, ok. We are still being too informal, because theres Bukkit team, the forum xy teams, coding teams..., bleeding (bukkit) team, other teams, people with direct access to the main repository, with the rights to close pull requests etc. for the rest: see other thread, somewhere :p.
     
  9. Offline

    xize

    hey I wonder why is the bukkit api not showable in the bukkit repo anymore?, has this todo with the same DMCA complaint?

    oh nvm, I was being stupid was looking directly on repo.bukkit.org but anyways it wasn't empty at first though.
     
  10. Offline

    asofold

    https://github.com/Bukkit/Bukkit

    Bukkit still is accessible, but CraftBukkit and similar has beem taken down due to that.
     
  11. Offline

    xize

  12. Offline

    krisdestruction

    Not sure what you meant by a. For b, can I also call you perspective, "as experienced by a consumer"? XD I do want to say that I am by no means a leading edge researcher in the field of economics, but I do have a working knowledge of how the concepts are applied. If there's anyone with a major in this field with insight, I'd really like to hear their perspective on this.

    There were definitely problems, as I would expect with any system. However all things considered, I think it turned out very successful for an open source community. I think they were simply limited by the number of contributors to the project. I don't think there was a shortage of plugin developers though.

    Your stance from the other thread, please correct me if I'm wrong :)
    I feel that the GPL is clear in this case. The only doubtable part in my mind is if Minecraft is used in CraftBukkit, but obviously this is the major conflict of whether the DMCA is valid. My stance is that MC is included in CraftBukkit from all the posts here and on SpigotMC. I believe that there were clear signs that Bukkit was not working out:
    I swear I remember a post from EvilSeph months ago that highlighted about miscommunication between Mojang and Bukkit but I can't seem to find it now...

    Both to blame, who to blame is in the air, but I still don't see how Wesley Wolfe was a lead and how he was directly responsible for the compilation of the code.
     
  13. Offline

    asofold

    There was more cases, e.g. communication and timing with the "safeguard", though i might actually see the "Reduction of requirements" as a positive thing. I think they were lacking the courage to go even one step further, like trying managed core-feature pull requests, or another form of public pre-implementation phase discussion. For a project with such need for contribution you do need to find ways to integrate core features faster - for that the managment has to manage (...) to integrate more people more easily. I don't want to belittle the achievements, but i noitced a lack of sense of direction and some integrative and balancing abilities there - maybe they were too taxed, but they kept too many secrets for such a state then.

    I can't really judge, but it smelt a bit that the team lead was not able to get Mojang closer to the boat, not in terms of "huge improvements", but increasing trust, obtaining little perks etc. Since EvilSeph left Mojang but stayed in Bukkit, all this still looks explicitly weird to me, to avoid using "looks like it smells".

    Edit: Yet again, i am missing so much information. That is what i will blame them all for at some point, so be prepared.

    Last random post: Wasn't he able to close pull requests? At least in the communication and closing of some he was quite present. To be fair after reading some, i would (if i was lead) have shielded him slightly more against unnecessary communicating with random people :p - i was pretty happy with the newer guidelines to add contribution.md and better link to that than writing something random. Unfortunately they were all not so inviting with the pr handling, so i kept away from those, because it was so hard to estimate what they would support (that's why i would have loved some default/managed mechnisms in there). We did have some direct channels to "core developers", namely Amaranth and feildmaster, but we did not and for other reasons could not make "most" of it, but it would have been good to extend from (rather for bugs / exploits).

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 10, 2016
  14. Offline

    krisdestruction

    Actually one thing that came to mind about why EvilSeph didn't publicly announce that Mojang owned Bukkit could be due to an NDA in the contract agreement. However if this was the case, it would be an asshole move on Mojang's part.

    Oh yeah, I see it as a positive thing too, but it was evident that Bukkit contributors found it hard to keep up with the MC changes. I thought they did do managed core-feature pull requests through their PR team :eek: I think any public preimplementation phase discussion was done on IRC lol. I'm not usually on there so I can't confirm. However I'm sure they did a lot of discussions internally. I agree that core features needed to be implemented faster, but I doubt they had the resource for this. I do believe that there was a general sense of direction from EvilSeph though.

    I mean, what's not to like. Mojang gets more sales, Bukkit gets more support, the community gets more frequent, less buggy releases. I was super excited when Bukkit leads were working for Mojang. I'm sure Bukkit leads tried to, and there's no excuse for Mojang not trying considering they owned Bukkit.


    I have no idea, but closing pull requests isn't the same as compilation if it were to pertain to our debate. Wesley Wolfe appeared to be a great programmer so I'm sure if he had that privilege, he would have done amazing work helping with these PRs.

    asofold If you are still interested in how the PR system worked, here it is. You were right, Wesley Wolfe was part of the PR system.
    http://forums.bukkit.org/threads/bukkit-an-autobiography.310083/

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 10, 2016
  15. Offline

    flying sheep

    grum says “nope”
     
  16. Offline

    krisdestruction

    flying sheep Thanks for the clarification :) Makes me wonder why now lol. Regardless my stance remains unchanged.
     
  17. Offline

    DrScream

  18. Offline

    emoser75

    Can you send me a one-time download link to the most current version of 1.7.10?
     
  19. Offline

    Ymerejliaf

    I've been running Bukkit servers since 1.2.5 and I've loved it. Single player is just boring, and Bukkit allows practically an infinite amount of possibilities to bring to Minecraft. To be honest, this entire situation is quite sad. I never thought anything like this would ever happen. The Bukkit community is just being torn apart. I'm trying to look at this in an optimistic sense, but there's not a lot to be optimistic about. I have a sinking feeling that Bukkit and all the Bukkit forks (Spigot, Cauldron, Glowstone, etc.) are going to die off. I hope my gut instincts are wrong... All of this is just horrible timing, what with the Bukkit team members stepping down and Mojang "taking control" of the project right before this DMCA thing came to light. I really hope that this will be resolved and Bukkit and its forks will continue. Otherwise... I think I'm done with Minecraft.
     
  20. Offline

    Mysteryron

    No matter what happens now.. Be it that bukkit shuts down or survives this, we should all look at all the memories that we have experienced. Good luck everyone, I hope this turns for the better.
     
  21. Offline

    CyberToon

    Glowstone isn't going to die regardless of what happens to bukkit. Not that Glowstone is very useful in it's current state, though.
     
  22. Offline

    Insaane_Scopes

    Well, it looks like bukkit is done for good, devs are leaving and mojang isnt going to help (with good reason) so if i want to host my server still, its gunna have to be on 1.7.10 :(

    I completely agree

    EDIT by Moderator: merged posts, please use the edit button instead of double posting.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 10, 2016
  23. That's what I'm saying!
     
  24. Offline

    domefavor95

    This does make for a good movie...​
    wolbukkit.png
     
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  25. Offline

    TayDaniel

    I guess I decided to learn this at a most amusing time, haha.
     
  26. Offline

    grid21

    I just wish someone would stop him. He has to deal with it, he doesn't own it, Mojang does, END OF STORY. Get over it and stop ruining a good thing. That's what I would tell him to his face.
     
  27. Offline

    Gamecube762

    grid21 He owns the code that he contributed to the project, and he has the right to deny use of that code.
     
  28. Offline

    grid21

    No, I beg to differ. Mojang bought it 2 years ago, therefor he in no way owns it. He only help code it, but he doesn't own it. Period!!
     
  29. Offline

    LokiChaos

    You can think that, but you'd be wrong. Copyright law is very clear on this. Mojang basically bought the name, and potentially the rights to the code contributed by those whom they hired. If and only if there was a specific clause in their employment contract spelling out the transfer. No one but Wolvereness can transfer his copyrights to another party, no one else can do so or coerce him to do so.
     
  30. Offline

    Gamecube762

    Mojang bought the project as a "Safety measure". If it would ever go down, they would intervene and keep it alive(probably till their own API was made).

    Then mind explaining me how the DCMA saw his claim was valid, and proceeded with the Take-Down notice?

    As far as I know, you are not a lawyer. I don't think you have the correct knowledge to correctly consider what someone owns and what protects those rights.
     
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